Radiant Ceiling Heat 1970S. I will have a professional come and do the work and getback to the discussion with the results. Sure enough, the wire was cut from above and you couldn't see the break from below. The hardware of this device is mounted over the head making it very practical for homeowner living in small houses. Of course the person standing next to the radiant panel is more comfortable, which means you CANNOT just compare air temperatures and do BTU calculations based on electric and gas. From above heating feels very,good on a cold terrace though, The floor keeps in between 21c and 27c Especially since electricity the the most expensive fuel out there. If an `incorrect` 120V(single pole) thermo was installed, but not wired correctly, it could allow continuity thru the heat elements hence still heating BUT the contacts WOULD NOT WELD TOGETHER!!!! When i gutted the bathroom i discovered radiant heat in the ceiling. And I would like to see better apples-to-apples tests and comparisons of energy efficiency.). Turn the breaker off before fooling with anything! Fire-resistive glazing is designed to block radiant heat transfer from one building compartment to another and protect people leaving a building through an exit corridor.Click here to view a video summarizing the risks of radiant heat. Thanks to haulbrookdf for your comment as well. Forced air heating and cooling is integrated and common in homes with existing ductwork. Radiant ceilings can easily operate at surface temperatures up to 100 F, delivering in excess of 55 Btu per square foot. Though its not always impossible to achieve zoned heating with traditional systems, newer technologies accommodate zoning from the get-go. Does anybody know about the panels from this company or the panels with embedded wires in general as it pertains to asbestos risk? Looks quite dated, going by the rest of the install would say no earlier than 1970's. Currently trying to suss out where its wired from. Dec 9, 2011. Below are some of the benefits you can enjoy: Fire Resistive Glazing Blocks Radiant Heat. (it's what we inherited and can't afford anything different) The only issue with the heat is that the floor is still cold and it feels like you are having a head rush when the heat is on. While that is a long time, the NAHB rates radiant ceiling panels with a 40-year life. We LOVE it and its still working great almost 60 years later except in laundry room where Len the Plumber cut the wires. Absolutely hate it. "Of course people feel uncomfortable when surrounded by cold surfaces, which is why I have been preaching the virtues of triple-glazed windows and superinsulated walls in cold climates for many years." Radiant ceiling heat in my 1964 build. Expected life - According to the National Association of Home Builders (NAHB), a cadet-type wall heater or baseboard heater has a 10-15 year expected life. I have the same issue and I dont know what it is but my electric bills are through the roof. We use the bathroom zone in the winter but otherwise we keep it at 50 degrees and heat with wood. If you're going to work on your system, be careful, you're playing with 220v. Between radiant and forced air heating and cooling, there are a world . I also suggest you get in touch with John Siegenthaler who is a guru in this area and he can walk you through all of the technical considerations. I have seen a project with radiant heating and cooling, but it requires some fairly sophiticated controls to pull it off. Just after we bought the house, a friend wired in a light/fan fixture, so I started there and removed the fixture and base. This is not a high heating bill for Minneapolis. there must be power coming from another part of the room. When the heat kicks on, blasts of hot air rush into the space until the target temperature has been reached. With radiant ceilings and floors comfort is achieved at a lower room temp, which can reduce the amount of fuel used by a few percent. Ellen- Sounds good. Dec 12, 2008. Our condo (built in the 60-'s) has a ceiling radiant heat system. It's also incorrect to state that you'll see higher heat bills. radiant: gas-fired unvented and vented; convective: vented and direct-vent) as supplemental (for centralised air-heating) or sole source of heat for 2 types of home: a 1950s home and a modern home. Sorry, Steve, but a BTU is a BTU. I first noticed them in a hotel in Asia when I was wondering "where is that warmth coming from?!". - and enjoy the extra punch of a focal heat source in the living room. Articles may contain affiliate links which enable us to share in the revenue of any purchases made. After a long, hard winter that saw record-breaking snowfalls and temperature lows, its only natural to look forward to the fairer weather ahead. Regular paint? Ceiled heat was the way to go. Holes can be cut forlights fixtures and it will still work. Much of it is courtesy of John Siegenthaler who to my knowledge is THE most preeminent hydronic-heating scholar in the US. Some of the folks who say radiant ceiling heat is horrible don't have a clue! Thus, it is possible to maintain the air temperature by 5C lower compared to classical methods at the same comfort level (Dudkiewicz and Jezowiecki, 2009). The average 65F radiant comfort temperature with 59F day/night setback should reduce building heat load by 25% to 35% over convective systems.". Why do you say this is my proposal? If you want steady, even heat in your home, one option is to forego traditional systems in favor of radiant heat. Radiant ceiling heat: This system heats the room from the top to the bottom. Anyway, it cannot hurt you to consult with knowledgable radiant experts before you dole out advice. Therefore, the bedrooms upstairs benefit from the heat on the first floor. From some work I've done on another area, it seems that each panel is powered individually from the rooms thermostat. 2. One wire is connected to the thermostat. Of course, Wright was ahead of his time in more ways than one, so it was not until decades after his death that radiant heat finally came into focus. Seven years or so ago we had a remodel done and our kitchen and bath wires were inadvertently cut. It is a unique feature of hydronic heating that one can change his mind. dose this thmomstat look familar to any one? Swapping in a condensing gas boiler for an electric boiler would indeed be far cheaper (and greener) for most of us. This was in contrast to a traditional. I am sorry this feels condescending to you, but the way you put down anyone who tries to explain radiant heat to you comes off as condescending and uninformed. Typically radiant ceilings in cooling absorb heat for 60-70% by radiation and the remaining (30-40%) by natural convection. One thing I will add is we hung a ceiling light and had to buy a stud finder from Lowes so that we didnt hit the radiant system. Concealed, Quiet System If you like to keep your home looking aesthetic and visually appealing, this heating system can be a great choice. Voltage from each hot wire to one of the grid leads showed 85v, same as my good room. The wires down to the thermostat are small (like standard thermostat wire), while the lines from the service panel to the box on the 2x4 in the attic are substantially larger. ( still feels 10 times less air movement that in our prior central heated house ) Do I need to do anything with the wire if I do clip it, beside insulating the end? Radiant ceiling panels cost about $50-60 per square foot. These stones would absorb the heat and slowly radiate it outward. Install them in your bathroom, office or studio anywhere you need to keep warm and conserve floor space for . Very thin (2-3mm) type of matting laid all around between the ceiling joists. I had the floor boards up today and noticed that the ceiling rose for the room below, was wired with 3 singles. Forced-air and baseboard (whether electric or hot-water) heating systems are convective systems because they use air as the primary heat-transfer medium. But even a gas-burning 50%-er would not make electric radiant mats a more cost-effective solution in most markets. To replace the old ceiling heat I had the Ditra floor heating system installed under my new tiles. I live in a house with radiant ceiling heat in VT. I said I'd have a Hi All, And I have 400+ sq. I live in central Ohio and live in a home that was built in 1974 and has radiant ceiling heat. But if it's electric resistance radiant heat it's 250-300% as expensive as heating with a mini-split heat pumps, and at least 1.5-2x as expensive as heating with non-modulating ducted heat pumps. It's the type with a wire snaked back & forth, embedded between two layers of sheetrock or plaster. We liked to have our bedroom cold and the rest of house warm. Here are two super-useful articles (10 to 20 minute read each): And yes, I find your assumption that I don't understand radiant heat -- whether from the sun, a wood stove, or one of your electric resistance panels -- to be somewhat condescending. Believe it or not coal and hot water heat did not effect the respiratory but forced air is a respiratory nightmare. If it leaves a client without power Hi everyone, One wire is connected to the thermostat. It uses a Switch Action Open thermostat. First of all, your lectures about mean radiant temperatures and comfort are condescending. Most radiant ceiling heat designs use electricity to warm an element, and allow the heat to radiate. Worst invention ever. Yes 70's or thereabouts. In addition, the system does not require much maintenance or cleaning once installed and one of the safest types of heating. energy consumption (Zmeureanu et al., 1988; Howell and Suryanarayana, 1990; Imanari et al., 1999; Petras and Kalus, 2000; Miriel et al., 2002; Feng et al., 2006) and (3) favorable tie-in Radiant ceiling panels go where other comfort solutions can't. With three mounting options, they can fit any ceiling space, helping to offset heat loss through perimeter windows and entrances. ( electrical,wire is buried at the bottom, would preferred a mid slab but it was to complex to install that way). Times have changed. Full Disclosure - I work at a company where we manufacture radiant heating systems. One of the styrofoam tiles fell out and it apears that the popcorn ceiling is covering the heating elements. Again, there's a large difference between heating the same air mass (electrical vs gas central furnaces) and localized zone heating that relies more on radiant heat transfer than convected heat transfer, which is more efficient and is noted to equate also with higher levels of thermal comfort. Houzz nutzt Cookies und hnliche Technologien, um Ihre Benutzererfahrung zu personalisieren, Ihnen relevante Inhalte bereitzustellen und die Produkte und Dienstleistungen zu verbessern. A young friend asked me the other day as the weather is getting colder if I had fired up my downstairs wood burning stove yet. We would like to put a ceiling can in our livingroom. worst heating ever and super inefficient. . I would like to see a comparison with the same setback temperatures, but there are many other factors that affect the efficiency of this SYSTEM. radient ceiling heat in all the rooms. What would cause cracking sounds with electric ceiling heat? All of the homes were designed to be heated with a new type of system called radiant heat; Levittown was the first development of radiantly heated homes in America. Though settings could be somewhat lower for other folks as we like to wear not much more than light clothes and everybody is bare feet. Hskidmore07 try calling a home inspector a local realtor can give you a referral.. Compared with concrete, aluminum is a staggering 232 times more conductive. Floors are comfortable due to that heat from the ceilings below. Certainly, there are aesthetic advantages to a heating system that does not force you to decorate around bulky radiators or wall-hugging baseboards. Update Bernie Gerry We purchased the house, and it was built in 1968 not late 70s. Or if heat loving relatives visit. Its 200 gallons. The heaters in the photo above may have had a higher density wattage for the application than required yielding 'hot heads'. Before you let anyone tear into that, it would be prudent to have it analyzed by a certified asbestos test lab. I sent them both a website inquiry. Broadly similar products exist on the market, but Warmboard stands alone in terms of efficiency and conductivity. Its facts and opinions are those of BobVila.com. Channel manager at Calorique. Clearly you are confusing radiant heat (electric heat under tile floors) with electric resistance heating by lumping them all in the same category. It has been efficient, reliable and clean! It looks dated. Many of your observations apply only to poorly insulated, leaky buildings, rather than the tight, very well insulated buildings advocated on this website. I would have thought that there would only be one source for each room. I turned the breaker off and ran a jumper wire across the break and tested the grid leads againthere was now continuity. (We have this type of heat in another home we have and I am always cold there. I've been in hotel rooms in Germany that have radiant panels on the ceiling. That is why radiant heat is far more comfortable to us because the radiant heat warms the objects in the room, making us perceive the room as warm. My daughter lives in an apt (built in 70s) with radiant ceiling heat. In this type of system, heat arrives, not via vents or standalone units, but from panels under the floor. Kingston - 12 miles.Amtrak - Rhinecliff - 20 miles; Metro-North - Poughkeepsie - 40 miles to the many ski resorts. Project Objective. (I don't know what they were thinking!) Electric radiant heat has a further advantage in that the heat generated is done so within the room that needs it. You are using an out of date browser. Bedrooms are so comfortable at times it is not even necessary to turn on heat in those rooms unless temperatures become extremely frigid. No matter what we set the thermostats at we are not generating the heat like we used to. Become a GBA Prime member and get full access to GBA articles, enyclopedia, videos, CAD library, and more. I have others, of course, but only in a pdf format. I put them behind the mirror in our master bath but we don't use them much because the walls are warm (good insulation) and the bath fan gets rid of the steam from the shower. convective heating system. The combination of these two effects significantly increase . The thermostats on radiant ceiling heaters operate differently than with central heating systems. Actually , the ceiling heat is my favorite with the radiant floor heat second. Ontario Hydro has warned homeowners that Flex-Heat electric radiant ceiling heating, installed in the late 1970's, is dangerous and that the system can fail without warning and may become a fire hazard. Do some research on how the systems work. So if youre sleeping in a second-floor bedroom, you no longer need to cover the cost necessary to keep the unoccupied first-floor at 70 degrees. The entire house is radiant heat in the ceiling, except the small kitchen which was an addition and has baseboard heating. We pay 0.075$ kw/h. Whats more: In a family with members who prefer different temperatures, zoning makes it so that everyone can get through the winter comfortably. Radiant ceiling heat is a style of heating that is significantly different from the radiators or forced air ducts that you may be used to. "Studies conducted by the American Society of Heating, Refrigeration and Air Conditioning Engineers (ASHRAE) indicate that with radiant heating systems people can be comfortable at temperatures 6F to 8F lower than with convective systems. Our friends' home just had a pretty bad fire and it was almost certainly this ceiling heat where it started. Was this under ceiling heating an infra red radiant panel? Show me where I proposed this. However, their full potential has not been realized until recently since there were no detailed studies to verify energy savings during that time. Water heated by the boiler could be pumped through the tubes, heating the concrete in the absence of sun. We often use them in small, outlining toilet rooms on commercial projects. She is a fire fighter and a paramedic. This year we decided to try to bear it and have set it at 61. I understand where you're coming from - it's a very common belief that you can equate a therm with the equivalent kilowatt and just multiply the costs to get a comparative answer, the truth is you simply can't. Here's another study involving radiant ceiling panels: Any homeowner that follows your advice may regret the decision -- especially if electricity rates in Minnesota ever approach the levels paid by homeowners in New England. Looking at buying an older home built in late 70's we think.. The remainder of sheets were 5/8 firecode. Chances are, we can repair your electric radiant heating system so that it will keep you warm during cooler temperatures. Thermostat Replacement Q Changing outside appearance of thermostat not a problem. Morgan, You must be a magazine subscriber to access this feature. Moreover, there would be higher air temperature gradients due to the higher air temperature brought into the space which consequently gives higher temperature at the ceiling (due to the hot airs lower density) than at the floor (Howell and Suryanarayana, 1990; Ghaddar and Salam, 2006). Seen it in a estate of bungalows in a village near us. How we perceive temperature, i.e. the ceiling was torn down with new insulation and pour barrier installed. They are 122 cm (4 ft) wide and 183, 244, 305, or 366 cm (6, 8, 10, or 12 ft) long. ), I ve personally visited a housenwith ceiling radiant panels, andi didnt like it When applied to the sizing of a radiant system, conventional heat-loss analysis often includes a reduction in design temperature from 70F to 65F and a 10% to 25% reduction in building air infiltration, exfiltration, stratification and glass heat loss. Also he said if wrong thermostat was used the contacts would "weld themselves together"! Radiant ceilings accelerate fast, when needed, to meet a big change in heating load. Manufactured gypsum board heating panels use an electrical heating element in 16-mm (f-in.) Ingeniously, hydronic tubes were set into the concrete flooring. This type of heating has the same advantages of other forms of electric resistance heat, including electric resistance baseboard, electric mats under your tile floor, and electric resistance space heaters. However, there was no voltage on the other grid lead. In these experimental efforts, the principles of radiant heating were often aligned with solar power. If you are sitting under a vent when the heat comes on, you know what I mean. Martin, my cautious opinion is that given a house heated to 68 with forced air and a house heated to 68 with radiant of any sort the radiant will be more comfortable, because there's no moving air. Performance. Please help.. thank you in advance.. Do I need to do anything special to paint my ceiling that has radiant heat? . Heat loss plays a huge role in how long the heat will last on your radiant ceiling heat. Baseboards have a High Surface Temperature. If I recall it was fed on the onpeak side of E7,and available 24hrs. https://www.calorique.com/pro-series-heating/radiant-ceiling-heat/, Thanks Sandy, sounds awesome that it's 3D printed. 1989). Would it by fine to just clip this wire, and lose heat to the one panel? The most practical thing for homeowner is to use radiant heaters to heat the ceiling mounts. https://radiantcooling.com/how-radiant-ceiling-works/. I am looking for some truth here and am always open to learning new things. Is there anything we can use to see for sure where it is so we could make a hold for the box?